Disappointed

Anything MG34 related.
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Disappointed

Postby anjongni » Sat Oct 20, 2012 11:45 am

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Nothing ruins a great German WW2 action photo than the appearance that it was staged. Couple of great photos: The FLAK-88 and entire crew ready to shoot down Fortresses would look much deadlier w/o the rain bucket over the barrel. Wait 'til someone pulls the lanyard! The nicely dressed panzer commander would be scarier if his twin MG-34s on his Pzkw-something had flash hiders instead of BFAs. I had to include the Graf Spee anchor chain hawsehole cover picture. In the lower right, the wedge that secures it has been lost, even though it was chained on! Somebody took it. Very un-Kreigsmarine of them.....Phil

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Re: Disappointed

Postby 42rocker » Sat Oct 20, 2012 2:02 pm

Nice eye on some still nice pics.
Thanks for posting them.

Later 42rocker

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Re: Disappointed

Postby DARIVS ARCHITECTVS » Sat Oct 20, 2012 9:11 pm

German action photos that are truly spontaneous are not common. Most of them actually were staged either for personal pictures or particularly for the German archives. But when you see something as blatant as a covered muzzle, it sorta takes away the illusion.
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Re: Disappointed

Postby anjongni » Sat Oct 20, 2012 9:50 pm

I see, pure propaganda opportunities! On a lighter note, I see that although the anchor chain appears chrome-plated, it drags across the polished wooden deck from the windlass to the hawsehole. At 200# a link, what a housekeeping nightmare.....Phil

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Re: Disappointed

Postby DARIVS ARCHITECTVS » Sat Oct 20, 2012 11:36 pm

Being a former ship sailor, I can tell that chain really IS heavy. It's painted with enamel that is surprisingly strong. Did you know that when anchoring the ship in deep water, the anchor does not provide most of the holding, but rather the chain?
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Re: Disappointed

Postby anjongni » Sun Oct 21, 2012 12:02 am

Great information. True story: as a youngster, touring a Fletcher class destroyer. The sailor was explaining the anchor system ("15,000' of chain") to our group and asked for questions. I asked "Sir! (he was a S3C), what's at the end of the chain?" His answer, "Kid, can you imagine what would happen if we dropped anchor in 16,000' of water?" I imagined that the end of the chain was , uh, bolted to the foreward bulkhead?...Phil

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Re: Disappointed

Postby DARIVS ARCHITECTVS » Sun Oct 21, 2012 12:41 am

Losing an anchor is a serious problem for a ship. If you did pay out all the chain in water too deep for the anchor to touch bottom, the chain would keep the ship relatively stationary with respect to the water currents. The wind effect on moving the ship would be minimized. It would take a lot of shots of chain to drop and anchor 15,000'!
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Re: Disappointed

Postby www.Prussia.us » Sun Oct 21, 2012 4:00 pm

Great pics, I am not surprised to assume most photos were staged. Just like many yards of US "WW1 footage" actually being filmed by the signal corp after the armistice. That is not to say brave people on all sides have not filmed/photographed during the chaos of battle but what is real/staged and what actually gets saved from the destruction of war is a craps-shoot.
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Re: Disappointed

Postby phil_uk » Tue Nov 06, 2012 6:00 am

In the picture of the tank,they are Twin MG13 and not MG34 :)

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Re: Disappointed

Postby Gulfstream4 » Tue Nov 06, 2012 12:07 pm

I was a Naval Aviator flying off of aircraft carriers. From my cruise book is the following: information about anchor chains.
Length of each anchor chain: 1,082 feet
Weight of each anchor chain link: 365 pounds
Weight of an entire anchor chain: 308,000 pounds
Weight of anchor: 2 at 30 tons each

Hope this helps

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Re: Disappointed

Postby anjongni » Wed Nov 07, 2012 12:13 am

If I remember Seamanship 101, one should pay out seven times as much anchor as the sounded depth. Frightening video of what can happen when all that weight goes out of control....Phil

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Re: Disappointed

Postby DARIVS ARCHITECTVS » Wed Nov 07, 2012 12:33 am

Notice how the guys kept loosening the band brake on the wildcat for a LONG TIME without paying out any chain? The brake was so loose that when the ship tugged the chain loose and it started paying out, there was NO way they could close the band brake in time. THEY LOST 11 shots in an out-of-control payout for a total of 14 SHOTS OF CHAIN! Excellent case of operator error on the part of the officers directing the operation. 14 shots is 924'. Ships don't carry 15,000' of chain... unless the chain locker is somehow combined with all the cargo holds.
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Re: Disappointed

Postby anjongni » Sat Nov 10, 2012 5:15 pm

Sorry, my mistake. The ship we visited was the USCGC Glacier, in Long Beach CA in the early 60's. The large amount of chain she carried may have been due to her duty as an icebreaker. She had a very storied career and is just now being scrapped, despite much demand to save her as a relic....Philhttp://www.navsource.org/archives/09/08/0804.htm


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