MG42 Loading Sequence

[Taurus454]

I was wondering what the impact would be of improperly conducting the loading sequence of the MG42. For example, place a single round in the MG 42 chamber with the bolt drawn back and then pull the trigger. The MG42 cycles perfectly.

The MG 42 H.DIV. 241 is supposed to be loaded with the bolt forward and three empty links placed on the cartridge stop in the Feed Tray so that the first Cartridge is on the left beside the Boltway.

What would happen if the bolt was pulled back and and the first live round was placed ON the Boltway and you attempted to fire?

Tom

[amafrank]

In an MG42 machinegun (I have no idea about the semi's) you can cock the bolt and lay a loaded belt in the feedway (or a couple live rounds), close the topcover and fire away. You can get a couple loose rounds to fire without a belt. You can drop a round in the chamber and drop the bolt on it to fire too. You can't do that with a loaded belt in the gun though as the bolt will hit the first round in the feedtray and try to push it into the chamber possibly firing the round there. If you leave an empty link in the way it will catch the edge of the slot in the feed tray and the link will be torn apart.

Hope all that makes sense.

Frank

[JBaum]

The MG 42 H.DIV. 241 is supposed to be loaded with the bolt forward and three empty links placed on the cartridge stop in the Feed Tray so that the first Cartridge is on the left beside the Boltway.

Tom

With the bolt forward, three empty links are used to keep the belt hooked in the feed tray with the first cartridge properly located relative to the feed pawls (one full cartridge space away from the stop). Three empty links are not placed on the cartridge stop, the end one is hooked over the belt holder. The other two are used for spacing to correctly locate the first cartridge properly in the feed tray.

What would happen if the bolt was pulled back and and the first live round was placed ON the Boltway and you attempted to fire?
Tom

If the bolt is at the rear and a cartridge is placed against the stop, and the trigger is then pulled, the bolt attempts to push the belt to the right a half space, but since a cartridge is already against the stop, it can't, so it jams things.

The feeding of the cartridge is half performed during the rearward travel of the bolt, and the other half of the advance is done when the bolt moves forward. Screw up the timing and it doesn't work.

[blackreichswehr]

Taurus454, i think you WONDER to much, your questions are always off the wall to suit me-- ask yourself the question and come up with an answer, then tell us your far out findings -- simple as are. good grief. not to be an ass , have some tack.

[Taurus454]

I think jbaum nailed it. I could find nothing that states the feed lever is moved as the bolt slides forward though it makes sense. I also agree it could cause a jam because there could be excess pressure on the round which would now be pressing against the stop and possibly keep the round from being clambered. Thanks to all who provided insight, greatly appreciated!

Tom

PS blackreichswehr will send you a PM

[Taurus454]

blackreichswehr,

LOL Just looked over your last few posts, looks like you are a little grumpy lately! Here is a clue, help out instead of shooting blanks. With all that self-professed shade tree experience of yours, a cool Nam Vet would have said,

Hey noob! Send me a PM and let me mentor you. You might learn something under my wing!

You know, wouldn't kill you to be social with a disabled vet on a social-type network. Heck if I was one of the Japanese girls you rambled about, I probably would have gotten more respect. BTW your comments about loaning a truck or wife were real insightful NOT!

Don't worry though, I still will buy you a beer if we ever meet! Your new #1 fan

Tom

[blackreichswehr]

taurus454, look pal, things are what are-- you sent me a PM saying, i called you out in public. i ain't calling you out-- this is'nt some DEAD WOOD show down. shade tree you say, crap -- what do you want, your own private parade for being wounded in combat, hell son, i've got half a arm missing and most of my hearing-- are you happy now, if not, why not? i still think you WONDER to much to suit me. i can introduce you some some of the biggest sellers of arms to GPM. plus some from myself, wonder child.

[banjoe]

Taurus 454 keep asking any question you want! You've done nothing worthy of this backlash. I think Mr grumpy should go back to bed and get up when hims feels better!

[Bil]

Play nice or the big guy will get mad!! No personal arguements. ---bil

[Taurus454]

Okay, I have one more question and need some advice! We want to check the Loading Sequence and identify where we may have a problem without the risk of actually firing. My question is, if the firing pin is removed from the bolt and you went through the loading sequence up to pulling the trigger, the gun would have no chance of firing, would it? The reason I am asking is that we would like to trouble shoot the gun without being on a firing range and don't want to risk actually firing the gun.

Yes, I know it could be a stupid question to some but we are by no means an expert or authority regarding the operation of this gun. We just want to be safe and that is our primary concern.

Again, thank you for your time and consideration of this matter!

Tom

[42rocker]

Tom
As I finish mine (ok, all sing, someday) I will first make, buy some dummy rounds to test with. The idea of testing with live rounds scares me. Even without the firing pin in... If I remember right in Pirate's build he talks about using dummy test rounds.
Load about ten or more dummy test rounds n a belt and cycle as needed to see how everything feeds. Then if all is good off to the range for a lot of single test rounds then go from there.

Enjoy Life.

Later 42rocker

[PortHolio]

x2. testing with live is poor practice in general, and it is possible to set one off even without a firing pin.

If a live round fails to extract from the chamber during cycling, and the gun tries feed a 2nd round in behind it, the nose of the 2nd round could impact the primer of the first round and set it off.

[anjongni]

Taurus, my friend Warhog is making me up some 8mm test rounds right now. They will have live primers, but no powder, with WW2 spitzer bullets. He's drilling a hole through the case so that the primer doesn't dislodge the bullet, and so my brain doesn't mix them up with the real thing. They'll make good display rounds after the test. I just want to chamber them to make sure that they feed, and it hits the primers good and hard. From my experience, test rounds chamber so hard that the bullet comes out anyway. I want to use full size rounds, and do this in the living room, kinda precludes using blanks.
I ordered a dozen at a dollar apiece, and some .45 too. If you want a couple let me know....Phil

[Bil]

Sounds good,and as for firing live rounds in the living room,I would not recomend it! In the movies they do it all the time,but even with ear protection,the noise is deafening! ( My son and I set up the 42 and lafette up in the living room on a rainy day,with it pointed out the front door towards a backstop. It was fun,but VERY loud! The AR15 was worse! ) ---bil
PS-there is a device that sort of looks like a hammer,that uses inertia to remove the bullet from the shell,you can make dummies like you friend using this,leaving the primer intact.

[42rocker]

Can't hold back..

Bil... Bil.... Can you hear me now???? And I don't think that I'm going to come around to your front door without letting you know well in advance.....LOL...

Liked several of the "blank" ideas. Thanks anjongni and Bil for the ideas. Use Bil's idea on bullet removal then carefully drill side and re-seat bullet to correct size (make go and no-go sizes) test for feed and lock up and then test fire. Outside works best I think....LOL...

I think several good ideas have come out of this topic.

Later 42rocker

[Taurus454]

Thanks guys! I didn't feel comfortable doing it and decided to ask the "smart folks" how to do it right. Yes, I'm a noob! In any case, I would rather look stupid asking a question than cause undue harm to anyone or anything because of my stupidity. I can't express my thanks enough to you folks who answered sincerely.

Phil,

Yes, Thank you and I would like to get some. I will send you a PM so we can make it happen!

Again, thanks everyone!

Tom

[anjongni]

Had these test rounds made up by "Warhog Outfitters" in Tennessee. Live primer, no powder,1/8" hole through the case. I want to to test-function the setup before hauling everything to the range.
Yes, I realize that they are potential projectiles so will aim at an appropriate backstop. I don't know if the bullet will dislodge, or get stuck in the barrel. They are pretty old (1956) but as long as the firing pin pokes the primer real good I'll be happy....Phil

[drooling idiot]

sounds like a squib load causing a bullet plugged and trashed barrel to me.

[anjongni]

Yes, probably. Fortunately, my barrel was so mecilessly shot out by the Germans that the bullet will probably just drop out the end! The victim is my panzer-TNW semi. I just want to make sure that it feeds and sets off the primer of the ammo I'd typically use, before schlepping it to the only place to fire belts, four hours away. I'm going to try to use the stock f/p spring instead of the heavy one that causes so much grief. I have a feeling that the heavy spring will be necessary. So if I'm still around in a week,

will give a report....Phil

[CRUSADER]

OK, I understand drilling the holes in the case to help ID the dummy rounds, but a live primer? Will the holes in the case actually vent the pressure out? The round will be chambered - so how will that work? The chamber wall will keep the pressure in, forcing the bullet out of the case ... right? What am I missing here?

DI makes sense - looks like these are going to act like squib rounds ... could be dangerous in a shot out barrel.

How about doing it the typical way - making dummy rounds with spent primers? If you want to test for solid FP strikes, maybe just filling the spent primer with a little clay or something might work. Or maybe machinists dye could do the trick.

There has got to be a better way - something that doesn't risk actually firing the gun. Yikes.